Why not giving a s**t about what other people think is good for your confidence

Welcome to Women in Confidence and this is episode 38 and today I'm joined by Brianne Hogan. Brianne is the author of two astrology books. She's also a podcast host. Woo, well done. An actor, cosmic creator, and a writer and her written work has featured in over 60 international publications and ones.

You are very familiar with such as the Washington post, the Huffington post L Canada, BBC future and whole stream of really big names and to quote her website. She is also a proud Canadian. Yeah. She also has a background in personal training and nutrition, and so is truly multi passionate. So Brianne, welcome to the show and thanks for joining me.

Oh, thanks for having me, Vanessa. It's great to be here. And you are coming from Canada today. Is that right? That's right. I'm in Vancouver. So we're. Your day ahead of me, for sure. definitely, I think about 18 hours difference. Yeah. Yeah. But I always say this when I have guests who are so far away, I just love the fact that we can have this conversation about the same topic, even if we are on different days and completely different time zones.

So with you being truly multi passionate, as I've just explained. I was thinking to myself, where do I start with you? Because the conversation is going to be so broad and there's so much you can bring to this discussion about women and confidence, but let's just start Brian with where I always ask my guests.

And that is what does having confidence mean to you? That's a great question. And I was thinking about it prior to. Conversation. And I think confidence for me because it's so funny cuz I don't walk in this world thinking I'm a confident person. So like when I leave my house, I don't think, oh, I'm a confident woman.

So it's a, just a strange thing to think about having that quality. But I think really for me, it's taking a chance on you like being all in on. And betting on you and trusting in who you are and what you wanna bring to the world and your unique gifts. And when I think about confidence in my own life, I think confidence is built and it's earned, and that's only earned through.

Taking risks and doing things that you don't know is gonna work out, but you do it anyway because it's what you feel you're called to do. So I think that's what confidence means to me. So can you recall a time or the last time that you tried something new and you guess you didn't know how it's gonna work out, but you did it anyway.

There's two. Very recently I moved across the country here. I was living on the other side of Canada and I wanted to move. I wanted a fresh start and so I took a job other side of the country. Canada's a very large country so it's huge, like a week drive to get here and not knowing anyone in the city.

I didn't know anyone who lived here in Vancouver. I was just very called. To do that. And I've done that many times in my life where I went to school in New York. Again, a city had never been to, I only applied to one school and I got in thankfully, but it just something again that I was just really called to do and then just last fall, I quit. I quit the job that I moved out here to do. Without I had freelancing to rely on, but really, it was just, I took a chance and it was because I was called to do it. And I thought this is what I wanna do. It feels really right for me. And I'm gonna quit.

you mentioned you had a call as something's come up for you and you've made these decisions. Help me understand. What do you mean by you had the call? Is it a feeling, is it a knowing? What is that for me? It's a definite knowing. Like it is an instinct. It's an intuition. It's something that holds at me.

Sometimes it's very instant. There's been things in my life where I instantly know that this is something that I wanna do. It's I instantly wanna try it. It could be almost a little bit impulsive in that sense, but I also think it's because it you're just so automatically drawn to this thing, this opportunity, this experience that it has to be.

For you. And then there's other times too. Like for instance, when I quit my job where it's funny, because I instantly knew I should have quit the job within months of getting the job, but it took me about 18 months to, to heed the call and to actually do the thing because of all the. The things we all get caught up in, the what ifs and the hows and just all the little fears.

Yeah, it's usually just a knowing of, I know this to be true. And sometimes it doesn't make any logical sense. I think most of the time it doesn't, but it's just something that I know to be true. And it's leaning into that trust, which I think is what the confidence thing is about. It's, even if there's no evidence that it's going to work.

I have to trust myself that it will, because it's what I'm being called to do. And trust in yourself is something that I coach on women to trust themselves and trust their instincts and trust their experience and all those sorts of things in order for them to make confident decisions. But it can be really.

Tricky, I think to trust yourself, because there is so much noise, whether that's other people's points of view, whether that's the media, how did you work through some of that to say, actually, I'm only gonna listen to Brian. I'm only going to do what Brian wants to do. How did you get through that? Oh, that's a good question.

I keep hearing my mom, my mother's voice in my head, cuz she's you always do what you wanna do. so I feel like that's partly built into my personality already. But I also think I STR I fight with myself because it's like, there's two halves of myself. Like one half is I know this is the right decision.

Like I know this is mine. I know this is what I need to do. And then there's the other half where you said there's all the fears and all the conditioning and all the other voices that we get sucked into hearing. And I think it gets so much where the noise gets. Heavy and so loud where it's like the only thing that's gonna shut this noise off is me doing what I know I need to do.

So sometimes I have to be, I have to be pushed like, and just, and then I just rip it off and I'm like, okay. And then I just. Shut it down because it's because I have to, I just, I have to get rid of the noise because that's the only way I'm going to get clear on what I know to be true for myself.

And I know it's hard to trust yourself. I know, I think another thing too, The pandemic helped a lot with this is just realizing that time is finite. And like how much time do I wanna be dwelling on this situation that I know isn't right for me? Or how much time do I wanna be in this situation?

That isn't right for me. And coming to terms with that, knowing that, life is short. And so why am I gonna be stuck here doing what I don't wanna do? I really like what you said about all the noise and the conditioning and, but just doing it because actually then all that noise and all those fears, and I suppose, limitations you put on yourself are other people put on you, they've gone.

They, you can't do anything about those. Now the action has been, I really like what you said there. And I think stepping into that fear can be really tricky for some people, but just, and I always advocate and previous guests have always said, look, sometimes you've just gotta do the action anyway. And it's even if it might not work out, it's a learning process.

So actually doing it, shuts all that noise up anyway, and you've already broken through some of that fear any by just getting on with it. And I think that really puts a lot of women really struggle with that. Just getting on with it, whatever it is, whether it's big or it's more, moving across the country.

Quite a big deal to many people, but the way you've put it and the way you, got yourself into that sort of mental space and spiritual is, has helped you build a life now in Vancouver. Yes. I think I've always had, I think the spiritual part is actually a huge component. As much as I have my own struggles with trust.

I think we all do. I think that's the human condition is like trusting if it's all gonna work out. But I think having a spiritual connection as a young, since I was a young girl has definitely, I think that's definitely helped me take bigger leaps or at least trust in. that I'm being supported that yes, I think a lot of it is to trust in yourself of course, but it does help to believe in something else because everyone needs that comfort, that sense of security.

And so I think that's really helped me and seeing the bigger picture, not all the time, we all get cut up in the little stuff. But when I've made those big decisions, whether I'm actually, it's funny, I was I'm writing this book proposal. About myself, about my own life. And one of the essays that I'm writing about is when I was leaving New York, I lived in New York for a number of years.

It was this big dream of mine. And I was at the end of my I didn't know it was gonna be the end of my journey, but I was at the end of my journey there. And it was this summer of just nothing going right. And I was just holding to onto this dream of New York, like by. Skin in my teeth and just clutching it because I did not wanna let this dream that I had go.

And I was just so terrified of being this failure. And, but it was like inside of me, I knew I had to let it go. Like I knew it was done like that part of my journey was done and I had to let it go to start a new chapter and. Yeah, it takes a lot of faith to do that because it's oh I wanted this for so long and I believed in this for so long, but now what, but it's just part of it.

It's just part of the journey. And you mentioned spirituality, what for you what do you believe and what supports you? Because it's spirituality can be very different things for different people, but for you, what does that mean? Yeah, that's something that I still think about a lot. and I think it's grown.

I think it's evolved. I think it's, I think it's evolved. I think there's parts of me that's been with, I was raise Catholic, so there's a part of me that still believe I do believe in God. I'm not a religious person anymore, but I do believe in God. So I had that structure growing up that I think helped.

Me at least in the formative years, but now it's, I've gone into intuition and taro cards and all those like thing, astrology, like all those other little tools that we are drawn to sometimes when we're trying to figure out what's spirituality means to us. And yeah, I think they're valid, I think, but really, I think it's really what comes back to it is now that I'm, as I said, I'm still trying to grasp what I think it is, but I think it has a lot to do.

Gratitude and knowing that we're all connected to one another and knowing that there is a purpose for us being here, it's not random and tapping into what that means for me specifically, and what are my specific gifts. And what's my journey and understanding that it's not going to be the same as everyone else's.

and that's okay. And coming to terms with that being okay. Because sometimes you want, what of someone else has that's where the gratitude comes in and yeah. And then just cultivating that own, your own language. I think too, what I've noticed even about myself. Like I go on Instagram and I look at all these accounts and I follow them and I think, oh gosh, like they're so tapped in.

And they know all these things that I don't and trying. Wanna getting all this information from them and what they have to say is helpful sometimes. But I think now I wanna, I'm more of along the lines of what do I believe in not what someone else tells me to believe in and not what everyone else is doing?

Although, Deepak Chopra typically write about a lot of things. But what do what's my relationship? What do I think, instead of looking to other per someone else to tell me that? And cultivating my own specific, unique relationship with spirit, that's just mine, and no one else can.

This is how you do it, yeah. I think you've hit on something that I have concerns because I've got two kids one's just coming out to 13 and the other one's gonna be 16 soon and they are largely fed what they're meant to believe and what they're meant to think through Instagram and talk.

And gosh, no, there's so many of them I'm so off touch, but actually there's a, I feel there's a generation coming through who perhaps don't have. The capacity or even the skills to really think, actually this is what I think, because this is me. Not some, I dunno, some, what do they call them influencer on to?

This is my thing. And I just, I do worry there's a generation coming through who are gonna lack the imagination to really step into that. What do I think space? I don't know, little aside, but I dunno. What do you think? Yeah, I think so. I think there's that whole comparison. That we never, I never grew up with, to a point you're always comparing yourself, growing up, in high school and you see some girl with this new dress or all this stuff, but not to the level that it is now.

I think, yeah, I think you see something on TikTok or Instagram and these influencers having. Extraordinary lives, and then you think that's what you should have or look at how they did it and they didn't need to go to school or, and then you used to start. It's true.

I do think social media as a whole has taken away. Creative thinking, critical thinking the ability to be alone and to disconnect and to tap into what you think, what do you feel? You're not bombarded by everyone. Else's opinions and perspectives. Like I was saying I can go down that rabbit hole easily and I think, oh my gosh, like she's got it all figured out then, and so you're like, okay, what is she doing? What's her spiritual practice? How is she manifesting? And then it's they don't, they. They have information that works for them, but that doesn't mean it's gonna work for me. And what do I think about this and what do I feel about, anything really is more important than what someone else is saying, so yeah, I do think it's it's a slippery slope. Yeah, the order I get, the more I know or realize that, nobody's got it figured out they literally, they might come across like they do, but really nobody does. And they may be looking at you going, wow, look what she's doing. And she's amazing.

And you're looking at each other saying the same thing. It's funny, but let's get back to you and your multi-pass because, I read them out at the beginning. How did you end up. With your writing and writing both articles and books, your podcast, your acting, your astrology. There's so much in there.

And also I haven't, your personal training, how did you end up with such an amazing sort of portfolio career in many ways? It's funny that you say amazing because. I grew up in a household where you'd have one job forever and that's that's what you're supposed to have. And so for me to be, having all these multi interests and to be an artist, I think that's really what it comes down to.

I'm just a really creative person. I just, I like to create, I like to express myself and so I always seek different outlets. Light something within me. And I'm like, I don't wanna try that. And so I'm just the type of person that I like to try different things. And I think that's a good thing. And that's just something that, very recently I've been able to really claim because as I said, I think.

I think it can look meandering to other people. I think it can look like you're lost. I've gotten that a few times when I was, in my twenties oh, you're, you don't really know what you wanna do. Do you breathe? And it's not that I didn't know what I wanted to do. I just wanted to do more than one thing.

and I think there's this commonality among a lot of people like growing up, you gotta pick one major, like in school, or you have to have one job and that's it. And I think, I don't think people are that simple. I think we're much more complex and a lot more creative. I think everyone's creative in their own way.

They don't need to be like a artist, but they can be creative in their own lives, in different ways. I think how limiting is that to be like, I'm this one thing forever. I just think I could never do that. And I knew that about myself, even though it was hard to say I'm gonna take a break from writing, cuz writing, wasting me out.

It was burning me out at one point and I was really into fitness and I thought why don't I try to be a personal trainer? Like, why not? And so I did. Or acting was something I was doing first. That was something that I wanted to do and then acting wasn't working out for me. But I was writing at the time, as I was saying near the end of my time in New York, I started to write some plates and I thought, I always really liked writing.

Like, why am I not writing? So I started to do that. And then I was writing plays and I. Well, this doesn't make any money, so how can I make money from writing? And so I, then I went into freelance writing and so I always maybe I always, I followed a thread of what I liked. I think I followed the thread of what I really enjoyed and just said why don't I just try that?

And that's and the same thing with podcasting. I always wanted to be like a journalist. Not a, just a, like a writing journalist, but I am now, but just, TV, anchor or something like that. And I thought podcasting is the new. The new thing like that. So I thought why don't I just try that?

So I think that's what I just I'm like, why don't I just try it? I love that you are exploring these things and I guess backed up by the trust that, you can do it because you've got this calling. But do you ever what am I trying to say? Do, do you ever just go against what your gut is telling you and your instinct and just be like, I'm just gonna try it anyway.

You might my body and my senses and my spirituality might be saying like, go there, but you, it works out all the same. Works out all the same. I don't know, actually, I, I don't know if that's ever happened to me. I think I maybe with relationships , maybe I go against the grain with relationships and then think I knew better than that.

No, I think what I do is because it's because of all what you just said, I think every time that I've not trusted my gut, or I've gone against the grain as you. It's led me to places that have not fulfilled me. And I think I've done. I've done what other people have told me that I should do and followed that other path because.

That's what everyone else was doing. So I felt maybe I should be like that too, because there's moments when you're an artist or an entrepreneur, or as you said, multi passionate. And as I said, people thought I was lost and then I think am I maybe I am. So then you think, okay, maybe something's wrong with me.

Maybe I am a little too much, like all over the place. That's when I've started to try to get a full time job, do the nine to five thing, even though everything against me was saying, don't do that. That's not for you. And that's okay that's not for you, but, and that's again, I guess not really trusting myself because I thought maybe that's not okay.

Maybe I should be doing what other people are doing. And so that's no, that's it steered me wrong when I went against the grain. And I can, I know why, because it's hard to stand out on your own and it's hard to. As I said, like trust in yourself as I have trusted in myself, but it's still been, it's still been difficult for me to do at times, especially when, as we were saying before with the noise and everything, you're just like maybe I should just do this other thing.

Yeah. I'm experiencing some of that now because I literally just resigned from a job that everyone would be like what, this is a stable job, it's a good brand. And it's all those sorts of things. But. I, and I'm sure there's lots of people, maybe not to my face, but behind the scenes going, what is she doing?

This is an insane decision, but it's my decision. And I absolutely hold that responsibility. But that was a feeling that was a knowing that there is something else for me here. There's a another purpose. And maybe it's about the podcast and certainly doing this podcast and meeting some people like yourself has opened.

Horizons so much. And, talking to you where you have all these amazing passions, helps me, but also helps all my listeners to realize there isn't just one stream for people there's so much that people can do to, fill up their bucket, unleash their creativity, give back to the world.

And so I don't really, this is a bit of a long sort of spiel, but it's just, it's great to hear people like you being successful. By not following the societal norms of you need a nine to five, you need to stick in a stable job. You need to get your pension sorted, all those sorts of things.

Whereas actually, you are refreshing in the fact that you are saying it's not always the way. And I love that. And how do you deal with the. The people who say you're lost the doubters, what's your response to those? As I said, when I was younger, I think I started, I took that on and I took it very personally not all the time, but I, it just depends on where you're at in life.

And then if you're in one of those dark moments and you're feeling insecure, then yes, all the noise is going to affect you. And you're gonna, and you're gonna doubt yourself and think, oh, maybe they've got a point, but now. I think of my age and where I'm at my life. And I see the trail behind me of the decisions that I've made and I didn't make, or the ones that worked out and the ones I didn't work out.

And now I think I don't give a shit what anyone said. I don't, because as I was just saying, every decision that I made that went. With the stream, went with all the other sheets that they were making. And I did it too. And I'm thinking, this is for me, I ended up miserable. I ended up not feeling like myself.

I ended up quitting those jobs. Like I didn't I don't, obviously I'm not working there now. And it just, it led me further away from the truth of who I am, and I look back and I, I don't like to have regrets and I don't. I think, oh man, like I wish I had just stuck to what I really wanted to do, sooner, just sooner.

Everyone has a journey, as I said, and I think everything does have an have its meaning and purpose and timing. But yeah, I think I wish because. It does attract you from who you are like, who you really are. And instead of who people think you should be, or who you were told that you should be, and so now, if anyone were to say anything, whatever , I do think there's far as you were talking. I was thinking actually, wouldn't it be a really good podcast to be called? I don't give a shit. Why anyone else thinks maybe I should rebrand this podcast from women in confidence to that, because actually the majority of my guests.

Largely done that they've been so true to themselves and they've understood themselves well. And like you are saying trusted themselves, that they haven't given a shit. So maybe yeah. Maybe in time I'll rebrand. my podcast to be that when I get a bit more bold. So how with your writing, where do you get your inspiration from?

Me, I think I'm just inspired by my own interests by my own life. Not in beginning as a freelance writer, it's true with any job. You're just, you try to get the jobs that you can. So even though I'm doing what I really love to do. In the beginning, it's like any job you just take what you can't.

So in the beginning it was writing about like real estate. I have, I know nothing about real estate , but I was writing about it or, just boring things, boring to me anyway. Maybe other people love reading about that. Obviously they did because I wrote it, but, not to me, but anyway, so it just kind.

Snowballed into a career, like one job led to another one opportunity led to another, and then it got to a point where I thought I'm gonna try to write what I wanna write. Maybe not every topic is. Is in, like a 10 for me, but at least it's connected to what I'm interested in and what I would like to write about.

And so now, for my freelance career and the publications that I'm writing for, they are in those fields of wellness and self care and fitness, which is an interest of mine, a passion of mine. And I do write about a spirituality and astrology sometimes. And I've carved out this little niche for myself where, maybe I don't a hundred percent get to write everything I absolutely adore, but at least it's in the ballpark of what I like.

And it makes it more, I think it makes it more enjoyable, obviously, not just for me, but the reader. I think, there's a, between writing and a reader and I think you can tell when you read someone's words that they interested in, what they're writing about. And so I think that helps. Everyone.

So I just like to write what I like and in your career from whatever whatever you've been doing, what's what are you most proud of? I'm most proud of. I'm most proud of of going for things. So I, yes, I wrote an essay for the Washington post, like a few years ago. And that was just an example of, I read a lot about writers and I belong to a lot of these Facebook groups and people get a lot, they get into their heads about pitching and they get scared that their pitch is gonna get rejected and they get scared about.

Everything like insecurity not being good enough and imposter syndrome. And I'm not saying that I'm not, I don't suffer from that because I do. I'm proud of the times that I, as I said, I didn't give a shit and I was just like, I'm gonna do this anyway. And I went for it. And when I wrote the article for the Washington post while I was writing it, did I doubt myself?

Yes, of course. Like I was write, I was writing. I was like, oh my gosh, they're gonna think this is crap. I'm not a good writer. But besides all that, what I'm proud of is that I actually thought no, when I pitched the essay, I thought, no, I am good enough for the Washington post. I am good enough. I am a good enough writer to do this.

And even if it's a no. At least I put my hat in the ring and at least I tried, at least I thought, no I'm a good enough writer for the Washington post here's my pitch. Take it or leave it, so I'm glad when I. When I think of those examples of just going for it, length the BBC two writing.

I wrote about windmills in prince Edward island. I was living there at the time. I know nothing about windmills, but , I wanted to write for the BBC. I thought that's gonna be an awesome byline. They were looking for something very specific and I found a story. That I thought could work, even though I didn't know anything about what I was gonna write and I pitched to them and they accepted it and I thought, okay you're gonna write about windmills, so you better start learning about it.

but I did. And it was fun and it got published and I still get some emails a couple years ago. I got an email saying, we looked at this article of yours and to study in school because it was so well cited. And so I thought, oh there you go. so so you never know where your, I guess your confidence is gonna lead you because I did have something to tell me, what, just pitch it and you'll just figure it out later.

You touched on something that must be met very raw to creatives, or are anybody who's having to beard or pitch for work is about rejection. And that can sting really internally rejection cuz it, and people do take it personally. How now do you, I suppose it's a bit similar to my question around the people who are doubters or say you are lost.

How do you then deal with rejection? Yeah, it's still hard. I've gotten used to it because it's it's like a dating game where you know, you're gonna go on a couple of dates. A couple of duds and they're not gonna be the one and you just gotta go through them because they're gonna lead you to the one that you want.

So I feel like that's what it is, where you have to try, because you're never gonna know. Or you have to get through your nos before you get to your yes. Type of thing. So I try to keep that in mind, because that is helpful because it's true. Not every pitch is going to be accepted and that's just what it is.

And even recently, I've been trying to write, get a pitch for cosmopolitan, like Cosmo magazine. And I got rejected like, I guess three or four times. And I thought I still stung. I was like, man, why can't I get into this magazine? So I go, I gave up for a little bit, maybe I'll go back to them, but then I just thought, okay, maybe my work is supposed to be.

And my energy, my intention is supposed to be somewhere else. I do think that there's a timing again, I think comes, it goes back to maybe my outlook on life where yes, I get rejected. Yes, it stinks. Yes. I don't like it, but when I take a step back, I'm able to be like, okay, maybe that wasn't right for me, there must be a reason why that wasn't right for me.

Let me try to, reframe this and then put my attention towards something else that it's probably better off. And maybe that's where I will get a yes. And for me, I didn't get into Cosmo, but then a month later, I got this random email from an editor at men's health, who I had emailed months ago.

I had, I forgot about her. And she said, I got your, oh, I found your email. I think you'd be a great writer for this article. Would you like to write it? And I was, of course. And then now I'm writing another article for them. So you don't know sometimes didn't know, as I said is your yes, even though it doesn't look like it, you just.

You don't know. So you have to just trust that it's gonna go your way in some way. Yeah. And for me, when you were talking, I was thinking that's, to me is part of the spirituality and knowing there's a higher purpose or a higher something looking after us, because whilst you didn't get into the cosmopolitan magazine the actual, the greater good was actually getting you into men's health.

And so it's almost like the protection of you by your spirituality in whatever sense that may be for people who are listening is moving you into the, to the right direction. And I dunno that for me is what came up when you were talking about that saying, okay, it might not be cosmopolitan, but redirect your energy to something else.

And look here comes a door that's opening, and it might be even better for you than what you originally thought. And that I've certainly started to approach my life in that way is actually there is something, a life force that is saying that might not be for you, Vanessa, but actually. this is, and your energy is better spent in this area.

So the rejection hurts in this place and it stings and it takes a while to get over. But actually it's all for the right reasons. So learn from it. Yeah. How can people get hold of you? How can they find out more about you? I know you're on Instagram cause I've seen you. So where can they find out more about you, Brian?

Yeah. So I'm on Instagram at Bri Hogan B R I E the cheese, I guess my website's Brien hunin.com. And then my podcast and my newsletter are linked on my website. So those are pretty much the big places that I hang out. I have a Twitter. I don't really like Twitter anymore. I don't like to hang out there anymore.

And yeah. And then face, I do have a Facebook page, but I think that's linked on my website as well. So yeah. Let's talk about your podcast. What's the title and what's the theme of it. My podcast is called, do you with Brianne Hogan and. It's what we were talking about before about saying F U to the nine to five jobs and people carving out their own lives and doing something differently, doing something that's more authentic to them.

That's the preci, which it was based. I got a tattoo, like I think it was over 10 years ago. Do you? I have it on my arm after I quit my one of another job, not the last job, but another job I quit it was another nine to five job that I quit. And I started my full-time freelance career, which is spawned everything for me at that time.

But yeah and it's just that's what it is. It's someone saying, you know what, I'm gonna do me. I'm gonna focus on what I wanna do, even if it doesn't look like what everyone else is doing, but I believe it's true for me. And this is who I am. This is what I do, and this is how I serve the world.

And yeah. And so I talk to a bunch of really different people like creatives and artists. I've talked to TA card readers, psychics, many experts, financial experts, entrepreneurs, and then the second season's launching in September and lots more. Different guests. Like it's actually surprises me that I'm getting now requests that people wanna be on the show actually, because they wanna tell their story.

And I think it's, I think it's a great platform for people to, to feel at home with being different. I think. That's what I like to have is to feel that we belong. If we don't feel like we belong, I would like for a place for people to feel like they belong. Great. So I'll put all those details in the show notes.

And for those who are listening to this podcast, that you are obviously into the podcast vibe, go and check out, do you as well by Brian Hogan? And I'll say I'll put all those details in the show notes. So people can also check out your staff and good luck with season two of that. And you are so right.

People. If people are starting to be attracted to your message and you are getting guests lining up, then you're obviously onto something really good there. So again, trusting your instinct on that one has paid off for you. What brand thank you very much for being on women in confidence. Is there anything you'd like to.

Like a one piece of advice before you, we sign off with people who are listening, who just wanna understand how they can build their confidence. I, the thing that comes to me is just, don't give a shit like don't. Don't let other people get to you. If what's true for you, because I really do believe that we do deep down.

I really do believe we know what's right for us, what we really wanna do. It's just that noise that stops us from doing the thing that we want. So if you can just tell them to just go away, shut up and just do your thing, because I think that's gonna lead you to what you want and. It doesn't matter what other people think.

It's what it's, what matter. It matters what you think. Yeah. Agree. Thank you very much for being on the show. It's been lovely having you. Thank you, Vanessa, for having me. It was great chatting with you.